Why never buy a BMW or any other that does the subscription scam

[yvesjv]

This is heavily criticized on the geek sites
https://www.theverge.com/2022/7/12/23204950/bmw-subscriptions-microtransactions-heated-seats-feature

In cold winters, you'll have to pay a subscription for the seat to heat up.
Guess most in NZ are going to dump that manufacturers car or run the car for a good few minutes with heater on first.
Until the heater becomes subscription base...

[wj957]

Once upon a time, in a land far, far away, lived a people who worked hard and saved little by little.
And with those hard won savings, bought a few luxuries which they then owned for life, and said luxury items were often handed down, father to son.

Opponents to this New World Order (NWO) often state;
"In the very near future, you will own nothing and rent everything, and you will be happy."

I used to buy CD's, but now my new Isuzu doesn't have a CD player.

Previously, I had a "Free" collection of favourites in Pandora's Box, but that was terminated for some reason. So I changed to Spotify and saved all my favourites again. After a period of time of free uninterrupted usage, I started getting ads. The ad frequency increased until it pissed me off! Then they offered a Premium membership, which was ad free for only $9.99 per month.

How long will it be before it becomes $99.99 per month?

I could see the whole system is designed to slowly suck you in, unlimited access to everything NOW!
It will only cost you a little piece of your soul.

The younger generation don't know anything, and don't care. 24 hour a day entertainment by visual or aural stimulation, disconnected from real people, real conversation and real life. With all the political propaganda entwined .............. and so they are lead like lambs to the slaughter.

Ok, I feel better now. Time to go put my head back in the sand.   

[WAI4WD]

The wifes BMW's for the past 13 years have all had subscriptions for something or other. Its basically a service cost for them to constantly update software, over the air software updates, Microsoft licensing for Office and other such software available on the system, etc etc. If you can afford a luxury car, you can afford the costs that come with it, from insurance to servicing and parts.

Isuzu, you get X amount of software updates free, then you have to pay for them. Software evolution costs them money. Not much of a business model if you give everything away free. Well, you won't be in business long.

The wifes car usually gets multiple over the air software updates per annum, and they not only add features, but they improve features. When we got her latest one a couple of years ago, the assisted driving sucked. It was like the new Dmax initially. Now though.... total faith in letting that car drive itself on a highway with little interaction from the driver. That was all software upgrades that are subscribed. I think they had pumped out about 6 updates that first year, rapid improvement in those features.

Like all cars, the speedo used to be several KM's out of whack. A software update some time ago installed a correction you can make yourself, to bring the speedo to the actual GPS speed. You're doing 100 and it says 100. That was developed after we purchased the car, yet we get the feature after the fact. That is what you get with BMW software subscription, ongoing improvements to your driving experience. There are many little features they have added since we purchased the car.

Just my two cents from someone who has had one in the garage for 13 years. They say BMW has been doing this since 2020, again, 13 years the wife has owned one, usually upgrades every 3 years, and each one has had a subscription service of some type available for it.

The servicing, she pays a subscription cost at the start and gets as many services as she wants within that period, no further cost for labour or parts. They drive from Geelong with a lone car to Melbourne, swap, then repeat the next day. No further cost. Not many manufacturers have service like that for their customers. I certainly don't get any of that from Isuzu, yet I also did not pay anywhere near the same cost for the Dmax.

For business, or luxury personal use, BMW is leading the way compared to Mercedes, which really crap on their owners after buying. We have friends who had Mercedes, even my sister had one, and they all eventually moved away to either BMW or Audi because Mercedes treated them like crap after the fact.

If memory serves correct, I think Hyundai or Kia were introducing subscription software too. Same reason... they can keep updating their cars and not lose money on it. Customers are happy, company stays in business.

I would love it if Isuzu had an over the air subscription service. I think the new Ranger has shifted to the same service. Features and upgrades at your finger tips.

If you haven't tried it, you should. I could understand people getting upset if they got nothing for their money, but we get updates and upgrades ongoing, no inconvenience to us, and amazing service from BMW. I mean next level service. Before having a BMW, I'd never experienced service of that level. They go the extra mile to keep you as a happy customer.

[dilbert]

I liked Lizard13's comment in the OP's link:
"Companies like this exist to extract money out of people who like spending money. Seems fair enough."

WAI4WD, it's notable that $ does not feature in your response. From what you've said, it seems that you are paying a subscription fee for regular maintenance, and other subscription fees for over-the-air feature updates. For the benefit of us pensioners out here, just exactly how much does all this cost? Be honest now, otherwise your deception is as bad as BMW's.

Regards,
Dilbert

[dilbert]

I'm totally fascinated by this BMW offering:

https://www.bmw.co.uk/en/shop/ls/dp/ISS_Offer_gb

A driving experience that stirs all the senses: transfer your vehicle’s unmistakable, sporty BMW sound directly into the vehicle interior with the IconicSounds Sport feature.

You pay AUD180 to activate, via remote software download, acoustic data that's piped into your sound system that replicates the sound of your car (from the outside presumably).

What happened to winding down the windows if you want that experience? A logical extension of this "functionality" will be the "wind-through-your hair" experience by manipulating the outputs of the climate control system!

Heaven forbid.

[wj957]

See, I prefer the real world, to the virtual world. I've ridden fast motorcycles most of my life with loud exhausts. And trying to get either the pegs, knees or elbows down in the real world, cannot be replicated in the virtual experience, because there is not the element of danger or death. I've survived, just. 

Now that I'm old, deaf and decrepit, I've settled for a bog stock d-max with a slow diesel and quiet exhaust.
But I have lived a life outside of a computer.

[WAI4WD]

WAI4WD, it's notable that $ does not feature in your response.

Subscription software usually works out around $100 per annum, bit more maybe. If you buy a service package, they range in cost, but are typically either side of 2k. Servicing is a bit different though. Wheels get balanced, aligned, anything that the vehicle needs to run as new, gets done.

You can see packages online: https://www.bmw.com/en-au/offers-and-services/personal-services/service-inclusive.html

It usually works out cheaper with the service package, especially with brake changes.

[yvesjv]

Its basically a service cost for them to constantly update software, over the air software updates, Microsoft licensing for Office and other such software available on the system, etc etc. If you can afford a luxury car, you can afford the costs that come with it, from insurance to servicing and parts.

[Begin rant]
To use this analogy with Microsoft, well I'm a Unix/Linux user and has been for decades.
This subscription issue with Office and other 'cloud' services just doesn't apply to the rest of the world.
They sell features you do not need but you have to buy the whole crappy thing (that has bells and whistles) to run an instance of Word, Excel or Chrome/Firefox...
Plus you have to update your hardware to run the latest fanciest version when you do not really have to
That is where todays marketing and the shrinks they employ have taken us, you are convinced to buy bloatware and feel good about it while your pockets are emptied.

When I buy a device, I research to see if it can be wiped and replaced with an open-source package running a *nix kernel.
They can take their subscriptions based support model to someone else that wants it and likes it, that is ok with me as it is traditionally so buggy that it keeps all IT techs in a job somewhere.
[/close rant]

Note:- A company called RedHat is trying to become the Micro$oft of the *Nix world by forcing their support model onto everyone.
Guess what happened, geeks worldwide united and rewrote their individual operating systems to bypass their crappy software trap.

[WAI4WD]

[Begin rant]
To use this analogy with Microsoft, well I'm a Unix/Linux user and has been for decades.
This subscription issue with Office and other 'cloud' services just doesn't apply to the rest of the world.

You can buy Office outright. You just don't get ongoing updates beyond the first year, same old, same old.

I do agree with your rant for some cases in software. A lot of companies have shifted to a subscription model instead of outright owning the software, which is just wrong. You should have the option, which Microsoft and others provide. You can buy lifetime in BMW too, for that car, for your account. Sell the car, BMW win and everyone starts again.

I seen an issue the other day with digital movies. A company went broke, so everyone lost everything. The TOS, like all of them state, even though you buy the movie, you don't own it. You have purchased the rights to access the digital version through their platform whilst their platform offers the service. If they shut it down, you lose everything.

Downloading them is much easier combined with Plex. Not that I know anything about that though!

[yvesjv]

Someone has already mentioned a way to deal with this:
Bimmercode
https://bimmercode.app

[WAI4WD]

Yer... hacking a BMW ECU would not be on my list of things to do. Especially within the warranty period. Even though it is for minor little things... not a risk I would take.

[Stepho_62]

Surely this is about ownership? I pay x$ and purchase a BMW which I then own.  If I want MY seats heated then I flick a switch. I’d be very interested in seeing the BMW purchase contract. Truth be known most BMW owners have lease agreements.

WRT software (excluding open source) you have never owned it, the money you pay gives you the right to use it in perpetuity until it’s superseded.

There is much more to this argument than just affordability and ownership.

[WAI4WD]

Surely this is about ownership? I pay x$ and purchase a BMW which I then own.  If I want MY seats heated then I flick a switch.

Yer, I don't know what there is new that the article mentions specifically, ours had buttons for seat heating. Maybe they're going down the route of a single seat for all vehicles which brings down the price for them, activating features via software instead?

[Navigator]

Surely this is about ownership? I pay x$ and purchase a BMW which I then own.  If I want MY seats heated then I flick a switch. I’d be very interested in seeing the BMW purchase contract. Truth be known most BMW owners have lease agreements.

WRT software (excluding open source) you have never owned it, the money you pay gives you the right to use it in perpetuity until it’s superseded.

There is much more to this argument than just affordability and ownership.

I haven't followed this issue really closely, but my understanding is that if you bought a BMW that included a feature, such as heated seats, it will always have them.  The subscription is for a feature your car doesn't have, but may still be included in it's wiring loom/ECU etc.  You pay the subscription and you unlock that feature, probably activated by an app or similar, and can use it for as long as you pay the subscription.  So effectively you buy a lower spec model, and can subscribe to higher spec features in the future.  If you buy the higher spec model to start with, you will always have it's features, although you may be able to subscribe and get updated/improved versions if you want.

[yvesjv]

BMW has replied:
https://www.thedrive.com/news/bmw-responds-to-fury-over-heated-seats-subscription-fee

Not looking good the future is...